LM34 Temp sensor

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LM34 Temp sensor

Postby Bill Felker » Tue Oct 15, 2013 12:03 am

I am looking to make a greenhouse environmental controller and am thinking of using a PIC and was wondering if anyone has had experience with LM34 temp sensor (Fahrenheit readings) Also looking for a humidity sensor. Any help with experiences with this would be greatly appreciated . 8)

Bill
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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby acestu » Fri Oct 18, 2013 4:00 pm

Hi Bill,

Welcome to the forums,

I think there is probably quite a bit about using that sensor and DHT11 sensors and so on in the forums, I have done some stuff myself, if you want to search the whole of the forum, you can type LM34 into the search box at the top right of the page, you should find lots of stuff on there.

Hope this helps / Just shout if you need anything else
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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby acestu » Fri Oct 18, 2013 5:28 pm

Hi Bill,

You might find this old post of mine interesting, it uses a DHT-11 sensor if I remember rightly and they are only a couple of pounds to buy.

viewtopic.php?f=46&t=11583

cheers
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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby K9ACT » Wed Oct 23, 2013 4:01 pm

Bill Felker wrote:I am looking to make a greenhouse environmental controller and am thinking of using a PIC and was wondering if anyone has had experience with LM34 temp sensor (Fahrenheit readings) Also looking for a humidity sensor. Any help with experiences with this would be greatly appreciated . 8)

Bill


Funny you should mention this application as it is how I got into PIC in the first place. I didn't know about the F version so I used the LM35 but after hacking away and even with the help of a very experienced PIC programmer we ended up using a 12f675 as a comparator for the fan control and then LM2903's for the heat controllers. They could have been combined into one but I was in a hurry for the fan so I did it the easy way.

I would like to use a PIC with an LCD for this but I need to learn to program first as nothing seems to fall out of the sky for me on this and my friend is getting weary of doing all the work.

Have you come up with anything yet?

Jack
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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby dazz » Wed Oct 23, 2013 8:29 pm

Hi Fella

With flow-code try to make all your variable meaningful to the job they perform again comment your code extensively as it will help you remember what a particular calculation or something else is trying to do , also try using a switch icon instead of a decision icon as a switch icon lays nice on screen and is quicker to read than nested decision icons(although they do the same job),
an example of a variable for a temp sensor rather than S1 try Temp_sensor_1 (although its looks a longer way you can just copy past it to a new variable then change the number, and it explains more readily what that variable does.
Make a Flowchart and paste it to the forum as some one will offer help or advice( i tend to give a quick answer so you can work it out as that way you will pick it up quicker, also if 10 people reply with different ways of doing the same thing, that's because ethers many ways of achieving the end result so pick the ones that fit in with your style etc.. So have a fiddle with say an LCD simulate it and if your stuck post your chart and someone will steer you right.

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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby Bill Felker » Wed Oct 23, 2013 10:41 pm

K9ACT wrote:
Bill Felker wrote:I am looking to make a greenhouse environmental controller and am thinking of using a PIC and was wondering if anyone has had experience with LM34 temp sensor (Fahrenheit readings) Also looking for a humidity sensor. Any help with experiences with this would be greatly appreciated . 8)

Bill


Funny you should mention this application as it is how I got into PIC in the first place. I didn't know about the F version so I used the LM35 but after hacking away and even with the help of a very experienced PIC programmer we ended up using a 12f675 as a comparator for the fan control and then LM2903's for the heat controllers. They could have been combined into one but I was in a hurry for the fan so I did it the easy way.

I would like to use a PIC with an LCD for this but I need to learn to program first as nothing seems to fall out of the sky for me on this and my friend is getting weary of doing all the work.

Have you come up with anything yet?

Jack

Hi Jack here is a quick and easy that I did to establish some of my concepts. I am using the ADC knob as a temp sensor and the LCD to record my ADC reading and my temp conversion. I did it to play with flowcode 6 and do not know if it is portable to lower flowcodes.

Bill
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temp example.fcfx
(7.62 KiB) Downloaded 147 times

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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby K9ACT » Sat Oct 26, 2013 2:35 am

I downloaded your program and diddled with it a bit but have no idea of how this all goes together and am getting totally frustrated again trying to learn even this seemingly simple method.

As one able to retire at 40 after a successful career manufacturing computer chips, I always thought I was pretty smart but this PIC stuff makes me feel like an idiot.

I have come to the conclusion more recently that the idiots are the ones trying to explain how to use the programs and not the users.

I have spent about 3 days looking for useful info on just this program and have come up only with videos that are out of focus, English that I can not understand, help lists to nowhere and tutorials more like hardware commercials than help.

I can't even find samples of working programs that I can putz around with.

Can anyone point to some help or should I just give up?

Even stranger, several emails to the sales department have never been answered.


Jack
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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby prasha920 » Sat Oct 26, 2013 10:47 am

HI Bill, can you upload the image of the program in jpg etc. format as i dont have F6 version to run the file you uploaded..

even i am using LM35 tempsensor in my current project. so i would like to know tthe method you used to display the output temperature.

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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby medelec35 » Sat Oct 26, 2013 11:43 am

Hi Prashant & Bill , I have not got an LM34 so this is only my theory so I can't guarantee it will work.
Reading variable as int (not Byte) then try the following formula:
Fahrenheit = ReadADCVariable *50/102

Below is my theory if you would like to know how I came up with the formula:
If you use ReadAsInt then resolution of ADC will be 5/1023 = 4.89mV
5 = 5V ADC reference
1023 = max number of steps of ADC (0 to 1023)

Since LM34 has a resolution of 10mV per 1F then ADC will increase by just over 2 every 1F
So we need to divide the total by 2 then by approx 1.02 (0.05/0.0489)
Since it's not recommended using Floats with PIC's that have lower ROM space (Floats can take 32 bits of ROM + space in ram for calculations), then we have to take the int result and multiply it first, just so we can divide by 1.02
= ReadADCVariable*100/2 then divide by 102
Since 100/2 = 50
I came up with the final formula of
Fahrenheit = ReadADCVariable *50/102

If anyone requires help in creating a flowchart with the formula integrated, then please let me know.

Since this is only theory can you please let me know if it works or not.

Thanks.

K9ACT wrote:I have come to the conclusion more recently that the idiots are the ones trying to explain how to use the programs and not the users.

I believe that's a bit harsh Jack, as the people you're calling "idiots" are trying to help you.
Many of those people e.g VC members and other forum users give up their free time to help as we are not employed By Matrix.
If you're hardware is not working as expected, try looking here first:
viewtopic.php?f=26&t=6936

If you find any posts that are useful, please click on the 'thumbs up' icon next to Quote button on that post.

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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby medelec35 » Sat Oct 26, 2013 1:31 pm

I have created a flowchart (with Flowcode V5) to display Fahrenheit and Celsius using LM34
Its untested so hope it works.

I have left both readings of Fahrenheit and Celsius on the LCD, so you can edit flowchart as you see fit.
LM34 Thermometer.png
LM34 Thermometer.png (85.31 KiB) Viewed 5229 times


Martin
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LM34 Themometer.fcf
(10 KiB) Downloaded 190 times
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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby K9ACT » Sat Oct 26, 2013 3:23 pm

medelec35 wrote:I believe that's a bit harsh Jack, as the people your calling "idiots" are trying to help you.
Many of those people e.g VC members and other forum users give up their free time to help as we are not employed By Matrix.


My apologies to the group if it was taken as referring to them. I was referring to the packaged information "out there" that is supposed to teach beginners how to program. I have purchased books and spent countless hours on the net trying to understand how to program pics using asm, C and not flowcode but I still can seem to get off the ground. The blinking led I referred to in another posting is the first thing I have ever done on my own but I can't take it any farther because of a lack of foundation and beginners information.

Here is an example of a brick wall for me.

The program in this thread uses an ADC. A component icon is pulled down but I have no idea how it became and ADC. I can't find a list of components anywhere.

This is the level I am at and need some help.

Thanks,

js
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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby Bill Felker » Wed Oct 30, 2013 3:59 pm

WOW, once again the membership here has taken a concept and shown way to go to make it a reality. This site is way better than the manufactures sites which deal with customers as tho they are all engineers. Love the ideas for this sensor use and the examples are great.

And Jack ,don't be so hard on everyone.I am an electronics guy who did maintenance in the semiconductor industry for 25 years. So I started with a little knowledge on programming, I was versed on the early basic and had a course in "C" in the early 90's .So I am NO expert but what they have accomplished here with flowcode is amazing and it will help you understand "C" better as you go along.As far as the PIC line of micro-controllers it is as good as the next and they do have customer support if you are having some problems. I guess the question you need to ask yourself is were are you lacking in knowledge on this subject and how can you gain this info in a way that is useful to helping you. As for a beginner in my opinion there is no better way to program a project than flowcode (unpaid endorsement :lol: ) I have been brought back into electronics because of the chance of coming across a pic controller at work and being told to ignore it because I did not have the knowledge to understand the design or programming of it. By the way that was the gauntlet and I not only learned how it worked I also with flowcode help wrote a program to make it work a little better.

:D Bill

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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby Bill Felker » Wed Oct 30, 2013 4:13 pm

medelec35 wrote:I have created a flowchart (with Flowcode V5) to display Fahrenheit and Celsius using LM34
Its untested so hope it works.

I have left both readings of Fahrenheit and Celsius on the LCD, so you can edit flowchart as you see fit.
LM34 Thermometer.png


Martin

OK nicely done Martin. Now how would you go to 1 decimal like say 86.3º F ?

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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby dazz » Wed Oct 30, 2013 5:54 pm

Bill Felker wrote:WOW, once again the membership here has taken a concept and shown way to go to make it a reality. This site is way better than the manufactures sites which deal with customers as tho they are all engineers. Love the ideas for this sensor use and the examples are great.
Yup love it here too

And Jack ,don't be so hard on everyone.I am an electronics guy who did maintenance in the semiconductor industry for 25 years. So I started with a little knowledge on programming, I was versed on the early basic and had a course in "C" in the early 90's .


I have been using pics for a while, i remember the early days trying to learn ASM , the only bit of ASM i ever got a grasp of was doing my c&g 224 had to programme a z80 to count if i remember correctly, hated Asm ever since :lol:, been trying to graso C as well, i've learnt more about C since using flowcode than i have in the last 25 years, ah basic the joys of programming sinclair zx products lmao.

Bill Felker wrote:So I am NO expert but what they have accomplished here with flowcode is amazing and it will help you understand "C" better as you go along.As far as the PIC line of micro-controllers it is as good as the next and they do have customer support if you are having some problems. I guess the question you need to ask yourself is were are you lacking in knowledge on this subject and how can you gain this info in a way that is useful to helping you. As for a beginner in my opinion there is no better way to program a project than flowcode (unpaid endorsement :lol: )


Said above about c i look at the c files and flowcharts as you can grasp a lot by working what does wha, tAs for learning flowcode we all had to start fresh at one point in time i can remember getting very frustrated trying to make a button do two things, worked on it for days and asked for help on here ,i was blown away as 2 very different solutions appeared, almost immediately, another tip is if you want to see what a component does, simply select it and then click on help and a page appears with the basics. I was lucky enough to beta test along with others, i also have visited Matrix and believe me even under pressure the Matrix Team are always enthusiastic about the product,and make time to visit the forums several times a day(also Matrix staff visit the forum off the clock in the evenings, goes to show how much they are behind the product), and will listen to users, how many software houses are like that

Bill Felker wrote: I have been brought back into electronics because of the chance of coming across a pic controller at work and being told to ignore it because I did not have the knowledge to understand the design or programming of it. By the way that was the gauntlet and I not only learned how it worked I also with flowcode help wrote a program to make it work a little better.

:D Bill



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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby medelec35 » Wed Oct 30, 2013 8:12 pm

Hi Bill,
Bill Felker wrote:OK nicely done Martin. Now how would you go to 1 decimal like say 86.3º F ?

Attached is a flowchart that displays to 1 decimal:
LM34 V2.png
LM34 V2.png (49.66 KiB) Viewed 5033 times

If you want the accuracy, then either floats or a different sensor that has a digital output should be used instead.
Just had a thought, What about this:
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=11555&#p42394
I know its not the LM34, but it may just what your looking for?

Martin
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LM34 Themometer V2.fcf
(10.5 KiB) Downloaded 158 times
If you're hardware is not working as expected, try looking here first:
viewtopic.php?f=26&t=6936

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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby Bill Felker » Wed Oct 30, 2013 11:07 pm

medelec35 wrote:Hi Bill,
Bill Felker wrote:OK nicely done Martin. Now how would you go to 1 decimal like say 86.3º F ?

Attached is a flowchart that displays to 1 decimal:
LM34 V2.png

If you want the accuracy, then either floats or a different sensor that has a digital output should be used instead.
Just had a thought, What about this:
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=11555&#p42394
I know its not the LM34, but it may just what your looking for?

Martin

After uploading it I tried to simulate it in flowcode 5 and the LCD shows no data. :shock: I noticed that in the upper left corner of the calculation icon is a big red dot and when it hits this it stops there and I have to hit run again to get it to read . :?: What does this red dot signify ?
Bill
Last edited by Bill Felker on Thu Oct 31, 2013 12:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby medelec35 » Wed Oct 30, 2013 11:50 pm

Hi Bill
Bill Felker wrote:After uploading it I tried to simulate it in flowcode 5 and the LCD shows no data. :shock:

Oops sorry, I have left a breakpoint set (Red dot), and simulation stops at every breakpoint that's encountered:
Removing Breakpoint.png
Removing Breakpoint.png (10.37 KiB) Viewed 5018 times

Just right click on the Icon that's got a red dot, and select Toggle breakpoint to removed it from the calculation box.
Then simulation should run fine:
simulation LM34.png
simulation LM34.png (7.95 KiB) Viewed 5018 times
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viewtopic.php?f=26&t=6936

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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby Bill Felker » Thu Oct 31, 2013 12:05 am

LOL ,I had edited my reply and afterwards I saw that you had addressed my question. :? Thanks I did it and it worked fine. :mrgreen:

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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby medelec35 » Sat Nov 09, 2013 10:32 pm

Hi Bill,
Glad simulation is working for you.
I was wondering if you have had a chance to test with hardware or not?
If so, did it work OK?

Thanks

Martin
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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby Bill Felker » Tue Nov 12, 2013 7:22 pm

I have not had the time to order a sensor to try it yet. I suppose I could use a lm35 that I have and see how it works for Celsius now all I need is some spare time, anyone have some? LOL :mrgreen:
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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby medelec35 » Tue Nov 12, 2013 9:30 pm

Hi Bill,
Due to the fact that LM35 is 10mv per deg C
and LM34 is 10mv per deg F then all you do is change your flowchart from displaying F to C
It should be a easy as that. :)

Bill Felker wrote:now all I need is some spare time, anyone have some? LOL


Sorry had a look and not got much spare myself.

Guess you need to buy some :lol:


Martin
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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby prasha920 » Wed Nov 13, 2013 8:22 am

hi bill and Martin,

if you want and have some 'spare time :lol: ' you can implement lm34 with the help of opamp and lm35 as you dont have lm34 sensor.
Using conversion formula of degC to degF. using opamp make circuit that will add 32 as an offset and anjust the gain of (9/5).
collectively the circuit output will be = (input * (9/5) + 32) which is degF output.
i guess u can try this out on simulation first.
hope this works.. :D





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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby Bill Felker » Sat Jan 18, 2014 10:58 pm

OK , after MONTHS I've finally set aside time to hook it up and try it and the program works well. It is very slow in response time and updating the LCD but pat of that could be my changing the chip parameters to "INTRC as clock out" because of not having a crystal in this circuit. What would the appropriate setting be for no external crystal ? But the bottom line is the program works :D Bill
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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby medelec35 » Sat Jan 18, 2014 11:25 pm

Hi Bill,
Glad it works ok for you.
It should update nice and fast, unless its the sensor?

Would you like to post the flowchart, if you have altered it, then I can take a look at it for you.
If you have the config set to clockout then are you able to measure the output frequency?

I have attached a flowchart that has internal osc set for 8MHz
Martin
Attachments
LM34 Themometer V2 16F88 8MHz internal osc.fcf
(10.5 KiB) Downloaded 94 times
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Re: LM34 Temp sensor

Postby Bill Felker » Sun Jan 19, 2014 12:52 am

I can post it. :) Bill
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