SuperCapacitor Backup supply
- Steve001
- Valued Contributor
- Posts: 1189
- Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:37 pm
- Has thanked: 460 times
- Been thanked: 523 times
- Contact:
SuperCapacitor Backup supply
Evening all
i have been experimenting with the attached circuit for a data logging project
The circuit is based around the following ic's from Linear Technology
http://www.linear.com/product/LTC3225
The LTC3225 is a programmable supercapacitor charger designed to charge two supercapacitors in series to a selectable fixed output voltage
NEVER SHORT THE TERMINALS OF A CAPACITOR TO DISCHARGE THEM - USE A BLEAD RESISTOR
http://www.linear.com/product/LTC4413
The LTC4413 contains two internal ideal diodes, each capable of supplying up to 2.5 Amps from an input voltage between 2.5V and 5.5V. Each ideal diode uses a low resistance MOSFET that independently connects INA to OUTA and INB to OUTB with a status output pin
The circuit is going to be subject to supply failures, because i am using a vdrive 2 i didn't want corrupt data so a method of nicely closing everything down was required.
the circuit consists of a super capacitor charger this charges and balances 2 x 2.7V super capacitors and has a charge done flag at 94% charge
this is fed into input A of the "ideal diode" so that the status pin is high when running on the capacitor supply
test circuit
1 x ECIO 40P
1 x vdrive 2 (just powered up not reading / writing)
1 x 4 x 20 EVERBOUQUET-MC1604B-SBLW-LCDMODULE
initial tests using 2 x 1F super capacitors
http://uk.farnell.com/bussmann-by-eaton ... dp/2148482
after failing the supply the output only held up the test circuit for approximately 2 seconds
a test was done without the display and the circuit held up for longer, i know 2 seconds is probably ok and a eternity in computing terms but will feel better with a longer time.
I will order some larger capacitors and have another play
http://uk.farnell.com/bussmann-by-eaton ... dp/2148486
Please note these ic's are tiny
Hope this is of some use to someone
Steve
i have been experimenting with the attached circuit for a data logging project
The circuit is based around the following ic's from Linear Technology
http://www.linear.com/product/LTC3225
The LTC3225 is a programmable supercapacitor charger designed to charge two supercapacitors in series to a selectable fixed output voltage
NEVER SHORT THE TERMINALS OF A CAPACITOR TO DISCHARGE THEM - USE A BLEAD RESISTOR
http://www.linear.com/product/LTC4413
The LTC4413 contains two internal ideal diodes, each capable of supplying up to 2.5 Amps from an input voltage between 2.5V and 5.5V. Each ideal diode uses a low resistance MOSFET that independently connects INA to OUTA and INB to OUTB with a status output pin
The circuit is going to be subject to supply failures, because i am using a vdrive 2 i didn't want corrupt data so a method of nicely closing everything down was required.
the circuit consists of a super capacitor charger this charges and balances 2 x 2.7V super capacitors and has a charge done flag at 94% charge
this is fed into input A of the "ideal diode" so that the status pin is high when running on the capacitor supply
test circuit
1 x ECIO 40P
1 x vdrive 2 (just powered up not reading / writing)
1 x 4 x 20 EVERBOUQUET-MC1604B-SBLW-LCDMODULE
initial tests using 2 x 1F super capacitors
http://uk.farnell.com/bussmann-by-eaton ... dp/2148482
after failing the supply the output only held up the test circuit for approximately 2 seconds
a test was done without the display and the circuit held up for longer, i know 2 seconds is probably ok and a eternity in computing terms but will feel better with a longer time.
I will order some larger capacitors and have another play
http://uk.farnell.com/bussmann-by-eaton ... dp/2148486
Please note these ic's are tiny
Hope this is of some use to someone
Steve
- Attachments
-
- SUPERCAP back up circuit.pdf
- (19.54 KiB) Downloaded 555 times
Success always occurs in private and failure in full view.
- Benj
- Matrix Staff
- Posts: 15312
- Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2006 10:48 am
- Location: Matrix TS Ltd
- Has thanked: 4803 times
- Been thanked: 4314 times
- Contact:
Re: SuperCapacitor Backup supply
Thanks Steve,
Been meaning to play with super caps for a while, looks like a good opportunity. Many thanks for sharing.
Could you run the display off the power supply and then only run the micro off the super cap backup, this should give you more runtime when the supply fails?
Been meaning to play with super caps for a while, looks like a good opportunity. Many thanks for sharing.
Could you run the display off the power supply and then only run the micro off the super cap backup, this should give you more runtime when the supply fails?
Regards Ben Rowland - MatrixTSL
Flowcode Product Page - Flowcode Help Wiki - Flowcode Examples - Flowcode Blog - Flowcode Course - My YouTube Channel
Flowcode Product Page - Flowcode Help Wiki - Flowcode Examples - Flowcode Blog - Flowcode Course - My YouTube Channel
- Steve001
- Valued Contributor
- Posts: 1189
- Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:37 pm
- Has thanked: 460 times
- Been thanked: 523 times
- Contact:
Re: SuperCapacitor Backup supply
Hi Ben,
I have played with that idea in a pervious project a while ago .I turned of the lcd back lighting after a few mins if no key was pressed with martins help
just a quick photo to show how small these ic's are
the device in comparison is a TL431 voltage reference in a TO92 package
Steve
I have played with that idea in a pervious project a while ago .I turned of the lcd back lighting after a few mins if no key was pressed with martins help
![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
just a quick photo to show how small these ic's are
the device in comparison is a TL431 voltage reference in a TO92 package
Steve
- Attachments
-
- 20160626_123440.jpg
- (230.35 KiB) Downloaded 2048 times
Success always occurs in private and failure in full view.
- Steve001
- Valued Contributor
- Posts: 1189
- Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:37 pm
- Has thanked: 460 times
- Been thanked: 523 times
- Contact:
Re: SuperCapacitor Backup supply
Hi benj
Eaton do some very large super capacitors up to 3000 Farads and made up modules also
http://www.cooperindustries.com/content ... itors.html
Cooper Bussmann
Cooper (UK) Limited
Burton-on-the-Wolds
Leicestershire • LE12 5TH UK
Tel: +44 (0) 1509 882 737
Fax: +44 (0) 1509 882 786
Linear Tech do some good super cap chargers
http://www.linear.com/parametric/superc ... r_chargers
Steve
Benj wrote: Been meaning to play with super caps for a while, looks like a good opportunity
Eaton do some very large super capacitors up to 3000 Farads and made up modules also
http://www.cooperindustries.com/content ... itors.html
Cooper Bussmann
Cooper (UK) Limited
Burton-on-the-Wolds
Leicestershire • LE12 5TH UK
Tel: +44 (0) 1509 882 737
Fax: +44 (0) 1509 882 786
Linear Tech do some good super cap chargers
http://www.linear.com/parametric/superc ... r_chargers
Steve
Success always occurs in private and failure in full view.
- Steve001
- Valued Contributor
- Posts: 1189
- Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:37 pm
- Has thanked: 460 times
- Been thanked: 523 times
- Contact:
Re: SuperCapacitor Backup supply
decided to dig out this little project again after martin jogged my memory
done some tests on autonomy with the capacitors
measured the current of a test pic form a unit a PIC16C710 this is monitoring a DC voltage and every 20 minutes turns on or off some transistors nothing too spectacular.this current was measured at 3.9mA with a fluke meter.
After some tests with a constant current generator it was found that 2 x 1F capacitors held the supply from 5.2 to 4 V DC for approx 18 - 20 seconds at this current level.
think i need to do some more tests with some other capacitors
steve
![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
done some tests on autonomy with the capacitors
measured the current of a test pic form a unit a PIC16C710 this is monitoring a DC voltage and every 20 minutes turns on or off some transistors nothing too spectacular.this current was measured at 3.9mA with a fluke meter.
After some tests with a constant current generator it was found that 2 x 1F capacitors held the supply from 5.2 to 4 V DC for approx 18 - 20 seconds at this current level.
think i need to do some more tests with some other capacitors
steve
Success always occurs in private and failure in full view.
- Steve001
- Valued Contributor
- Posts: 1189
- Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:37 pm
- Has thanked: 460 times
- Been thanked: 523 times
- Contact:
Re: SuperCapacitor Backup supply
Afternoon All,
Dug this out again, and done some more tests with a Ecio and a 4x20 Backlit display 80mA all together
so using the following
1 x 20 farad capacitor - 2 mins 30 seconds
2 x 20 farad capacitor (40 farads total) - 4 mins 45 seconds
https://uk.farnell.com/vishay/mal223091 ... p/2930854?
this is only from 5.1 volts to 4.5 a further time extension could be gained by using a 3.3 - 5 volt dc-dc convertor to step the voltage back up to 5 volts
Steve
Dug this out again, and done some more tests with a Ecio and a 4x20 Backlit display 80mA all together
so using the following
1 x 20 farad capacitor - 2 mins 30 seconds
2 x 20 farad capacitor (40 farads total) - 4 mins 45 seconds
https://uk.farnell.com/vishay/mal223091 ... p/2930854?
this is only from 5.1 volts to 4.5 a further time extension could be gained by using a 3.3 - 5 volt dc-dc convertor to step the voltage back up to 5 volts
Steve
Success always occurs in private and failure in full view.
- Benj
- Matrix Staff
- Posts: 15312
- Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2006 10:48 am
- Location: Matrix TS Ltd
- Has thanked: 4803 times
- Been thanked: 4314 times
- Contact:
Re: SuperCapacitor Backup supply
Hi Steve,
Wow that's a decent amount of time to keep the MCU running for. How long does it take the cap to charge back up when powered on again?
Wow that's a decent amount of time to keep the MCU running for. How long does it take the cap to charge back up when powered on again?
Regards Ben Rowland - MatrixTSL
Flowcode Product Page - Flowcode Help Wiki - Flowcode Examples - Flowcode Blog - Flowcode Course - My YouTube Channel
Flowcode Product Page - Flowcode Help Wiki - Flowcode Examples - Flowcode Blog - Flowcode Course - My YouTube Channel
- Steve001
- Valued Contributor
- Posts: 1189
- Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:37 pm
- Has thanked: 460 times
- Been thanked: 523 times
- Contact:
Re: SuperCapacitor Backup supply
Hi Ben,
I didn't measure that to be honest, just switched the supply back on and went for some dinner
I will measure it and let you know
Steve
I didn't measure that to be honest, just switched the supply back on and went for some dinner
![Laughing :lol:](./images/smilies/icon_lol.gif)
I will measure it and let you know
Steve
Success always occurs in private and failure in full view.
-
- Matrix Staff
- Posts: 9520
- Joined: Sat May 05, 2007 2:27 pm
- Location: Northamptonshire, UK
- Has thanked: 2585 times
- Been thanked: 3815 times
- Contact:
Re: SuperCapacitor Backup supply
I think its a great idea!
Gives the hardware time to complete all routines to go into shutdown mode.
This could include displaying a message on an LCD stating: power failure,
Going to shout down in 10, 9 , 8 etc/
Thanks Steve
Gives the hardware time to complete all routines to go into shutdown mode.
This could include displaying a message on an LCD stating: power failure,
Going to shout down in 10, 9 , 8 etc/
Thanks Steve
Martin
- Steve001
- Valued Contributor
- Posts: 1189
- Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:37 pm
- Has thanked: 460 times
- Been thanked: 523 times
- Contact:
Re: SuperCapacitor Backup supply
Hi Martin,
I am using it with the Vdrive you sorted out for me,
i use it because i am plotting voltage every 10 seconds of some batteries until the deep discharge protection operates then micro can shut down and close the txt file and not corrupt anything when the power goes.
The IC's are Tiny did struggle soldering them
Steve
I am using it with the Vdrive you sorted out for me,
i use it because i am plotting voltage every 10 seconds of some batteries until the deep discharge protection operates then micro can shut down and close the txt file and not corrupt anything when the power goes.
The IC's are Tiny did struggle soldering them
Steve
Success always occurs in private and failure in full view.
-
- Matrix Staff
- Posts: 9520
- Joined: Sat May 05, 2007 2:27 pm
- Location: Northamptonshire, UK
- Has thanked: 2585 times
- Been thanked: 3815 times
- Contact:
Re: SuperCapacitor Backup supply
Great idea!
How is the Vdrive performing?
Wondering if worth having a Vdrive component?
Alternatively there is the FAT SD component.
The only difference for people that don't know about Vdrive.
It reads and writes to USB flash drive, instead of SD card.
Martin
- Steve001
- Valued Contributor
- Posts: 1189
- Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:37 pm
- Has thanked: 460 times
- Been thanked: 523 times
- Contact:
Re: SuperCapacitor Backup supply
Hi Martin
Vdrive working well - I did find they are a bit finakey with usb sticks though.
i didn't manage to get a .csv working with it though but works well sending to .txt I then copy and paste to excel so i can do my graphs.
do worry about long discharge times, and the amount of data going on the usb stick but not had an issue as yet .
V Drive Component - mm thats an idea
Steve
Vdrive working well - I did find they are a bit finakey with usb sticks though.
i didn't manage to get a .csv working with it though but works well sending to .txt I then copy and paste to excel so i can do my graphs.
do worry about long discharge times, and the amount of data going on the usb stick but not had an issue as yet .
V Drive Component - mm thats an idea
![Mr. Green :mrgreen:](./images/smilies/icon_mrgreen.gif)
Steve
Success always occurs in private and failure in full view.
-
- Matrix Staff
- Posts: 9520
- Joined: Sat May 05, 2007 2:27 pm
- Location: Northamptonshire, UK
- Has thanked: 2585 times
- Been thanked: 3815 times
- Contact:
Re: SuperCapacitor Backup supply
When multiple files with different file numbers saved on the vdrive,
I used Auto hotkey to automatically merge all the files into one CSV file. at the click of a button.
Worked well for me as kept the files small so there was a fair few after 6 months, when I revisited the site Vdrive was installed on.
I used Auto hotkey to automatically merge all the files into one CSV file. at the click of a button.
Worked well for me as kept the files small so there was a fair few after 6 months, when I revisited the site Vdrive was installed on.
Martin
- Steve001
- Valued Contributor
- Posts: 1189
- Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:37 pm
- Has thanked: 460 times
- Been thanked: 523 times
- Contact:
Re: SuperCapacitor Backup supply
Not heard of that will look into it sound a lot easier, than copy and paste each file .....I used Auto hotkey to automatically merge all the files into one CSV file. at the click of a button.
![Embarassed :oops:](./images/smilies/icon_redface.gif)
![Laughing :lol:](./images/smilies/icon_lol.gif)
I did a quick test last night, current limit set at 150mA. I was only timing with the stopwatch on my phone and watching the current drawn on a meter the 20 Farad one, from completely discharged 40 seconds @ 150mA , then approx. 3 mins to reduce to 10mA.Ben:
How long does it take the cap to charge back up when powered on again?
Suppose this part of the charge curve to reduce to its minimum value will take a long time.
Steve
Success always occurs in private and failure in full view.