EB-006-00-9 need help [SOLVED]

For E-blocks user to discuss using E-blocks and programming for them.

Moderators: Benj, Mods

lomovic
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 10:58 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 1 time
Contact:

EB-006-00-9 need help [SOLVED]

Postby lomovic » Tue Jul 07, 2015 6:31 pm

Please help about this matrix programer. I read all post, but I not solve my problem. My board always stop and write fault BOARD HAS NO POWER. Operation system is windows 8.1 profesional.I took print screen of fault, and picture of board. 5V is present on regulator, microcontroler, but mloader stop.
Attachments
picture3.jpg
picture3.jpg (81.61 KiB) Viewed 19228 times
picture 2a.jpg
(279.2 KiB) Downloaded 13150 times
Last edited by lomovic on Wed Feb 01, 2017 3:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Steve
Matrix Staff
Posts: 3073
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2006 3:59 pm
Has thanked: 87 times
Been thanked: 387 times
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby Steve » Wed Jul 08, 2015 11:26 am

Hello lomovic,

Do you get the same error when using mLoader directly to send the file? The mLoader.exe is in the "/Tools" folder of your Flowcode6 install and the HEX file for your program will be in the same location as where you saved your program.

Please let me know if this has the same problem.

If it does, you could try powering the EB006v9 board from the USB socket instead of using the screw terminals - there is a jumper next to the power socket.

Regards,
Steve.

lomovic
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 10:58 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 1 time
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby lomovic » Wed Jul 08, 2015 9:22 pm

Thanks for help.
This board is new. When start mloader , loader run (on board turn on lamp D10 Prog) and off lamp D10 and write BOARD HAS NO POWER.
I read all instruction from device and forums, but not solve the problem.
We have oscilloscope and I took picture from oscilloscope. When I run mloader to save hex to pic voltage on Vdd from 5V fall down do 2,47V. Picture MATRIX02 is voltage on Vdd pin PIC on stand by,when mloader start that voltage fall down to 2,16V picture MATRIX01 and stop write message BOARD HAS NO POWER.
I took all picture from computer and board
Attachments
picture3.png
(175.65 KiB) Downloaded 13116 times
MATRIX01.PNG
MATRIX01.PNG (9.66 KiB) Viewed 19194 times
MATRIX02.PNG
MATRIX02.PNG (9.53 KiB) Viewed 19194 times

kersing
Valued Contributor
Valued Contributor
Posts: 1873
Joined: Wed Aug 27, 2008 10:31 pm
Location: Netherlands
Has thanked: 530 times
Been thanked: 1040 times
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby kersing » Wed Jul 08, 2015 9:50 pm

Does your power supply limit the power (current, amperes, not volts) it supplies to the board? Programming mode is a larger load for the power supply.
“Integrity is doing the right thing, even when no one is watching.”

― C.S. Lewis

lomovic
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 10:58 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 1 time
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby lomovic » Thu Jul 09, 2015 9:10 am

Thanks kersing, but problem is on the board. On circuit diagram look Q3 (FDC634P) - Vcc is present all time (when supply from USB and when supply is from PSU). On the other side is VCCchip that is connect to Vdd on all PIC. When no programing mode that is present 5V, but when I start mloader himself or direct programing from flowcode6 that voltage Vccchip drop down do 2,16V, but 5V is present on Q3 Vcc.

I send question to forum but no answer from MATIX TECHNICAL SUPPORT.

User avatar
Steve
Matrix Staff
Posts: 3073
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2006 3:59 pm
Has thanked: 87 times
Been thanked: 387 times
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby Steve » Thu Jul 09, 2015 9:34 am

Another though I've had is you may have damaged the board if you have wired the power incorrectly. Generally we expect the boards to be powered via the power socket as this input is protected.

The screw terminals are unprotected and generally used for supplying power out to "downstream" E-Blocks, so if you have put any power into the +5V pin or accidentally reversed the polarity on the "+14V" pin then you're likely to have damaged the board.

Is this a possibility?

All our boards are fully tested before leaving our factory, so I'm confident the problem did not exist when we shipped the board.

kersing
Valued Contributor
Valued Contributor
Posts: 1873
Joined: Wed Aug 27, 2008 10:31 pm
Location: Netherlands
Has thanked: 530 times
Been thanked: 1040 times
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby kersing » Thu Jul 09, 2015 1:19 pm

lomovic wrote:I send question to forum but no answer from MATIX TECHNICAL SUPPORT.


The first reply to your message was from Matrix support. As well as the message just above this one.
“Integrity is doing the right thing, even when no one is watching.”

― C.S. Lewis

lomovic
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 10:58 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 1 time
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby lomovic » Thu Jul 09, 2015 7:47 pm

Please, I have many years of electronic work. I am development enginner and work in electronic from 1990 and work with PIC and microcontroler from 2000.
Work with many program and programer for microcontroler.
First if power from USB port some port have current limit and you post to connect extern power to board.
I read circuit diagram on the end of pdf EB006 manual and know how is connect external power.
+14V is connet before 7805. 7805 is IC to stabilize 5V to power board. After 7805 is 5V on all board. First if want to stabilize 5V (7805 have drop down voltage about 2,5V) min voltage is 7,5V above this voltage IC not stabilize. First I dont go voltage to much because work to many year with 78 ic-s.
On picture is 10V and that is ok to drive 7805.
Board have 3,3V IC which have supply from 5V regulator. All that voltage is ok all the time (when is stand by and when is in programing mod).
And have 5V on VDD pin PIC.
But when I run to programing and D10 go on(to indicate that in programing mode) power on chip go down do 2,16V and program stop and write BOARD HAS NO POWER.
If look on circuit diagram on end EB006-30-9.pdf on page 11 you see transistor Q3 (FDC643P) and voltage on VCC (left side) is 5V always, that voltage is from 7805.
On right side is VCCchip and 5V is present, but when start programing this voltage drop down to 2,16V measurement and took picture from oscilloscope.
Picture of osciloscope is on that point Vccchip or Vdd on PIC chip. I measure that voltage on Vdd pin of chip.Measure on Q3 it is not posible.
I measure voltage on 7805 out pin all time. 5V is stable.Only voltage VDD on chip is fall down.
I took all picture from board when I measure voltage,picture from computer when run mloader and flowcode6, but limit is 3 picture.
I need help like what I do to put board on.
If some of electronic engineer from Matrix produce flow diagram to detect faul or to go board on.
Like
1. connect board on usb
2. measure voltage on board Q2
3. if voltage below defect is IC1
4. connect wire from emiter that component
etc.

kersing
Valued Contributor
Valued Contributor
Posts: 1873
Joined: Wed Aug 27, 2008 10:31 pm
Location: Netherlands
Has thanked: 530 times
Been thanked: 1040 times
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby kersing » Thu Jul 09, 2015 9:01 pm

1. Disconnect external power.
2. Set jumper J11 to USB position.
3. Set jumper J12/J13/J14 to USB position.
4. Test if programming still fails. If so, continue with step 5.
5. Remove 16F628 and place other type PIC. (The 16F1937 that came with the board)
6. Create very simple flowchart for the new PIC.
7. Program this chart to chip.
8. Report results.

BTW I've worked with electronics and micro controllers since early 1980s and still make mistakes every once in a while (I'm human) resulting in the magic smoke being released...
“Integrity is doing the right thing, even when no one is watching.”

― C.S. Lewis

lomovic
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 10:58 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 1 time
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby lomovic » Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:45 am

Step from 1 to 4 is still fall down.
Step from 5 to 7 still fall down.

D:\Flowcode 6\tools\mLoader\mLoader.exe reported error code 255 - this message after programing

Please next step.


Please do like profesional not like child you broken my toy.

lomovic
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 10:58 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 1 time
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby lomovic » Fri Jul 10, 2015 10:21 am

I really appriciate your assistance kersing, I am as well thinking to return the product as I am gething out of options. Have you ever had to return anything to Matrix and are you informed about procedure (who should I contact to return this part)?

kersing
Valued Contributor
Valued Contributor
Posts: 1873
Joined: Wed Aug 27, 2008 10:31 pm
Location: Netherlands
Has thanked: 530 times
Been thanked: 1040 times
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby kersing » Fri Jul 10, 2015 10:30 am

1. Can you measure the signal on Q2 input or output to see the waveform when switching to program mode?
2. What are the chip settings in Flowcode for your device? Is Low Voltage Programming enabled? If so, please disable and retry.
3. Did steps 5-7 result in the same error you got previously? (No power)

Regarding RMA, I never had to return anything, however Google provides the following link: https://www.matrixtsl.com/resources/files/misc/Matrix%20Returns%20Form.doc

(Ok, me updating my post while you replied confused the forum software somehow, I had to repost this answer and delete my previous message)
“Integrity is doing the right thing, even when no one is watching.”

― C.S. Lewis

User avatar
Steve
Matrix Staff
Posts: 3073
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2006 3:59 pm
Has thanked: 87 times
Been thanked: 387 times
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby Steve » Fri Jul 10, 2015 5:31 pm

Full returns policy is here:
http://www.matrixtsl.com/returns_policy.php

lomovic
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 10:58 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 1 time
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby lomovic » Fri Jul 10, 2015 10:08 pm

Board is on road to check in MATRIX. But I can answer of question number 2. Yes I read manual and in manual is write that EB006V9 do not support to program on low voltage because some of pin microcontroller is diferent. The same thing BOARD HAS NO POWER.
Thanks a lot everyone for help!

john_m0ers
Posts: 26
Joined: Wed May 07, 2008 3:41 pm
Been thanked: 3 times
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby john_m0ers » Tue Sep 29, 2015 11:36 pm

@kersing
forgive the intrusion, but I keep getting badgered by the free windows 10 upgrade. Does it dynamically turn off power to usb ports as earlier windows have?, as this used to
cause all sorts of problems for usb devices.
Also, don't feel too bad, in the late sixties I had just finished building a five valve battery superhet receiver, and eager to test forgot filament voltage on psu was set to 6.3 instead
of 1.5 to 2volts. Result, five brand new and expensive valves all with open circuit filaments!. Also first z80 ics with craters in the middle because 5v psu was 5.8v due to iffy voltage pot.
john

User avatar
Benj
Matrix Staff
Posts: 14371
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2006 10:48 am
Location: Matrix TS Ltd
Has thanked: 4447 times
Been thanked: 4145 times
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby Benj » Wed Sep 30, 2015 10:48 am

Hi John,

windows 10 upgrade. Does it dynamically turn off power to usb ports as earlier windows have?, as this used to cause all sorts of problems for usb devices.


I think it is highly likely. Windows 10 is basically a modified Windows 8 which is basically a modified Windows 7....

User avatar
Steve001
Valued Contributor
Valued Contributor
Posts: 1086
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:37 pm
Has thanked: 440 times
Been thanked: 492 times
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby Steve001 » Wed Sep 30, 2015 12:53 pm

hi,

To prevent Windows from “managing” power to your USB controller or devices, follow these steps:

Open Device Manager
start > control panel > system > device manager

or

by typing devmgmt.msc in the Start > Search panel.

The Device Manager window will open.
Expand the Universal Serial Bus controllers branch then double-click the USB Root Hub device, and choose the Power Management tab.
Turn off the Allow the computer to turn off this device to save power by unchecking the box then click the OK button:
Repeat the step on each USB root hub or do it only for USB ports that you want to be permanently powered on.
If you experience lost USB connections or power from a USB port to your auxiliary device,
try the steps above then idle the device and wait for a few minutes to confirm that the device is not getting powered down.

Hope this helps

Steve


:Edit this is for windows 7, not sure if the same applies for windows 8 or 10 machines
Last edited by Steve001 on Thu Oct 01, 2015 12:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
These users thanked the author Steve001 for the post (total 3):
LeighM (Wed Sep 30, 2015 2:07 pm) • Benj (Wed Sep 30, 2015 3:48 pm) • medelec35 (Sat Oct 03, 2015 8:22 pm)
Rating: 15.79%
 
Success always occurs in private and failure in full view.

kersing
Valued Contributor
Valued Contributor
Posts: 1873
Joined: Wed Aug 27, 2008 10:31 pm
Location: Netherlands
Has thanked: 530 times
Been thanked: 1040 times
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby kersing » Wed Sep 30, 2015 5:38 pm

Yes, Windows 10 has the 'Allow the computer to turn off this device...' options so it might cause the same issues.

For Windows 10 to open device manager:
Start Explorer (file browser), On "This computer" right click and select 'Properties' (bottom of menu), in the left menu choose 'Device manager'.
Or from start open 'control panel', choose 'info' in the left menu and 'Device management' should be at the bottom of the right panel (might require scrolling to the bottom).

Once you've opened device manager use the instructions provided by Steve in the message above this one.
“Integrity is doing the right thing, even when no one is watching.”

― C.S. Lewis

User avatar
medelec35
Valued Contributor
Valued Contributor
Posts: 8440
Joined: Sat May 05, 2007 2:27 pm
Location: Northamptonshire, UK
Has thanked: 2412 times
Been thanked: 3451 times
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby medelec35 » Wed Sep 30, 2015 5:58 pm

kersing wrote:For Windows 10 to open device manager:
Start Explorer (file browser), On "This computer" right click and select 'Properties' (bottom of menu), in the left menu choose 'Device manager'.
Or from start open 'control panel', choose 'info' in the left menu and 'Device management' should be at the bottom of the right panel (might require scrolling to the bottom).


My preferred method is to hold widows key then press x.
You then get the following:
Win key x.png
Win key x.png (7.49 KiB) Viewed 17354 times


Also useful for Admin command prompt, program features, disk management etc.

Martin
Martin

If you read a post that is useful, please show appreciation by clicking on thumbs up Icon.

john_m0ers
Posts: 26
Joined: Wed May 07, 2008 3:41 pm
Been thanked: 3 times
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby john_m0ers » Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:29 pm

Hi, thanks for all the help. If you had your eb006 connected to a usb port, what would happen if windows couldn't tell if any thing was connected, would it turn off?
Also, does the eb006 somehow "keep alive" the usb port/hub?
Sorry for all the questions, but just curious about possibilities.
Thanks again, regards
john

EtsDriver
Valued Contributor
Valued Contributor
Posts: 413
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 4:19 pm
Location: Kajaani, Finland
Has thanked: 328 times
Been thanked: 211 times
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby EtsDriver » Sat Oct 03, 2015 7:54 pm

If the eb006-09 was returned to MatrixTSL, id like to hear from matrix or you lomovic about the board what was the cause for dropping voltages, and if the board is broken, could you or matrix team test the regulator outside of the board. If regulator works fine, there is malfunctioning board. But if regulator is not working, I suspect that the regulator has suffered either overvoltages or inverted plus and minus.

I work on the industry and we had massive amount of boards that the designer had inverted the + and - input on connectors, and the symptom "voltage dropdown when load applied" on this case are similar, so I'm curious about this.. :D
Ill just keep the good work up!

lomovic
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 10:58 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 1 time
Contact:

Re: EB-006-00-9 need help

Postby lomovic » Sat Oct 31, 2015 1:23 pm

EB-006-00-9 have error. Matrix replace board.
My new board is OK. Everything works well.

MANY THANKS EVERYONE

----*******MATRIX******------- IS THE BEST
:D
These users thanked the author lomovic for the post:
medelec35 (Sat Oct 31, 2015 1:44 pm)
Rating: 5.26%